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Embracing Vulnerability: Megan's Journey Through Motherhood and Personal Healing
Have you ever felt the weight of the world on your shoulders, only to realize it's not the globe that's heavy, but the unprocessed baggage of your past? Join us as we sit down with Megan, a Canadian expat living abroad with her two kids, to explore the raw and often unspoken challenges of motherhood, personal trauma, and authenticity. She reveals how facing her repressed trauma head-on reshaped not only her relationship with her children but also the core of her own identity. Megan's courage to say "no" to life's imposed scripts has set her free, and her journey is a powerful testament to the transformative effect of vulnerability.
This episode weaves through Megan's experiences as a solo parent without a traditional support network, emphasizing the critical role of self-awareness and setting healthy boundaries. As she shares her insights on parenting, expat life, and the importance of self-care, it becomes evident how essential it is to prioritize our own well-being. Megan's frank anecdotes and reflections on personal development remind us all that growth is a continuous journey, not a destination, and that community and self-compassion are the bedrocks of resilience.
Megan's narrative is interwoven with discussions on the complexities of navigating behaviors, understanding our personal capacity, and communicating within our relationships, especially during times of tragedy. Her stories of confrontation with resentment, grief, and the pursuit of balance between self-care and family life offer a wellspring of wisdom for anyone grappling with similar issues. Whether you're seeking solace in shared struggles or inspiration to embark on your own path to healing and understanding, Megan's conversation with us is a beacon of hope and a celebration of the indomitable human spirit.
Do you have a story to share? Interested in being a guest? Fill out our inquiry form and we will be in touch!
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Join me, portia Chambers, as I sit down with women just like you, sharing moments in their lives that shape them into who they are today Stories of motherhood, betrayal, transformation, love and loss, vulnerable conversations, deep connection and collective healing. Welcome to the this Is we podcast. I am so excited to have our next guest here with us. Megan is a Canadian expat, mom of two who has been working like hell to create the life she wants to live, not the one Megan was conditioned to accept. Megan truly believes that by sharing her ongoing journey and unraveling a lifetime of repressed trauma, figuring out what she wants to create and the legacy she wants to leave with her family and how she wants to experience life, it allows others to not feel so alone in their journey. Megan is coming home to who she is by learning to listen and honor her intuition, while saying a big fuck you to all the conditioning that doesn't align with her.
Speaker 2:Megan, welcome yeah girl, how are you? I'm good. How are you Good? It actually sounds better than like I thought it did when I was typing. I was like this is cringe worthy.
Speaker 1:It's like that. Everyone says that every single time I read a bio, everyone's like oh, sometimes it's hard to to like, listen and absorb, but it's beautiful and it's your story, and so, on that note, give us a little bit of backstory of who you are, why you're up to your children and everything in between.
Speaker 2:So I know like we don't have five years for me to really get into this, but I am a mother of two, as you said, and really in the last I don't know this is kind of like. I guess I should probably go like chronologically, so that I'm not bouncing around. So I'm an expat. I have almost completed 12 years now outside of Canada, which is bananas. I left when I was 24 years old and then now 36.
Speaker 2:This journey of ours initially took us to the Middle East, to Qatar, which we are currently still, but in that we had previously relocated back to certainly not back to Budapest, hungary, and that's because my husband's Hungarian, canadian and then pandemic happened. We all know what happened with that Borders were closed, families weren't seeing each other, my family being one of those and we came back here. When we came back here, I was not I didn't do it willingly, I did it out of obligation to my family. Obviously, I had two very, very young kids. My kids are only 55 weeks apart, so I will take that Irish twin title, even though technically they're not. So we came back here and things kind of really escalated for me in terms of, like, my unhappiness and my just discontent with where I was in my life and like all these feelings that were like constantly brewing underneath and like I was seriously trying to repress it all. Over the last two years I've had a couple catalyst things happen in my personal life with my mother. I don't have a father, I never really had a father. That's a story that I'm still kind of investigating myself.
Speaker 2:But through these kind of events that had unfolded and were currently unfolding, I really started to shut down and I was really not present for my family, I was not present for myself. I was like so unhappy, and living in a place where I was unhappy kind of blew it up let's just say that and it was just like am I going to deal with this now or am I never going to deal with this? So I chose to deal with it and I chose to face it and I am facing it and it's not been easy and it is not something that I really understood and it's not something that I 100% understand. But that's cool because that's what the journey is. The journey is continually unfolding and I've been opening up about this and a lot of people have been coming to me and saying me too.
Speaker 2:I have these feelings too. I just didn't want to talk about them. So that's kind of like we'll go more, I guess, into detail about it, but like as kind of like the surface level. That's sort of like how my trauma I grew up in a really broken home one riddle with divorce, addiction, neglect, abuse, and it just never went away. We always think that we can repress it, but I think once you have kids that beast is going to put a spiky head right back out there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, especially if a lot of it happened while you were a child. I know something very similar happened to a friend of mine. She had, after having her son, a lot of repressed stuff started to come to light and she was just like some of the things that she didn't even remember as a child, like, just like things were coming up and she's just like, okay, I have to deal with this now because I might not even be here, you know, to deal with it.
Speaker 2:That's the thing, right. Like it just becomes all-encompassing, like it literally takes over every part of your psyche, of your physiology, of like your body, and you really just it comes out of nowhere, like you kind of don't even see the cause of it. But you know it just doesn't feel right, it doesn't feel like you and it's not what you want to be doing.
Speaker 1:I want to talk about what you just said. It doesn't feel like me. What are some of those emotions, those heavy feelings that you were experiencing, that other people are kind of relating to?
Speaker 2:Doubt, a lot of self-doubt, tons of shame, tons of guilt, tons of embarrassment, like I don't know. I have a really hard time with separating words because I find like a lot of words kind of overlap, especially like in the definition too. Like even with my therapist I'm like, well, I mean this, but like I also mean this, but I think like so, for me shame and embarrassment is kind of the same thing, like a lot of the ways that I would react to my children. So I'll kind of preface this too. So I have two kids, like I said, both fiery redheads, gorgeous as can be, but both of my kids were born with a very rare disease. It's called classic lactosamia, so it affects one in about 60,000 people.
Speaker 2:And my both my kids have it, so I know right, like this is this is a total Megan thing, like if something weird is going to happen, it's going to happen to me. But that's also like my energetic disposition With my kids, like there is a lot of host of situations. You wouldn't know what to see them. They are pretty, quote unquote, normal.
Speaker 2:There is no normal Like, let's just break that right now. But I was having to kind of navigate their behaviors, their diets, their complications, and I was doubting myself in every step of the way and I was finding that I didn't have a support system to fall back on in terms of family and it was really pissing me off, like I was so resentful towards them and this resent towards it was coming out in the way that I was like handling these situations or, or you know, adversity that would come my way and I and it really was like I would see it on my kid's face, I would see that feeling of like, oh fuck, I didn't, I didn't want to do it like that, but like this is what all I know, this is what's in my subconscious. So I would start getting these really shameful feelings about, like the way that I reacted to something that my kids did or a way that I reacted to a situation that I was faced to, and I was like what, why am I feeling shame? Like what is causing these feelings? So that's when I started to ask, okay, well, what, what do I want?
Speaker 2:Like, what would feel like the right answer for me, or what would feel like the right reaction for me, and it's to like a lot of questions. It's not like I said oh hey, what would this feel like for me? I have the answer. It doesn't work like that. It's like really asking okay, but why? Okay, but why, okay, but but what did that? Like you know what I mean Like really unpeeling that onion and really getting down to it, and that's kind of like where I'm starting to find out what and how I want to be reacting to situations.
Speaker 1:I love how you brought up. You know, it's not just one question with yourself, it's multiple questions that you're asking to yourself. Because I think that's so valid and true? Because I kind of had this experience with my husband where he was just like, you know, I was upset about something. And I was just like like I'm so upset. And he's like, but are you upset because of what they said or are you upset because they, that they were saying it behind your back, which are two very different reasons to be upset. And I was like, oh, my initial reaction was like I think I was upset with what they said, but when you had changed it and asked that different question, I was like, oh, no, I'm more upset because they just set it behind my back, and that's what makes me more upset than actual what they said. I could care less. And then it had to me.
Speaker 1:Then I had to start, you know, diving into why does that make me feel upset? What's the insecurity that's making me feel that? Is it just this particular situation? Have I experienced this in the past? Like it just didn't end up being like oh yeah, I guess I'm upset because they talked about me. It was like, no, I have to continue to investigate it, because I don't really want to feel like this again because I can control only myself. I can't control them, but if I allow them to control everything, I'm just going to be like so sad every day.
Speaker 2:And it's like almost like I don't know about you, but like when I find myself like really getting inquisitive and like really doing that deep dive, like I don't know how to really articulate this, but like the word the solution is, or like the cause of it is usually like a one word thing, it's like a pandemic failure, mistake, or like that is what my core wound is.
Speaker 2:So it's like getting down to those core wounds and I think a lot of us kind of get stuck on that superficial level of like solving the problem because it's easier, we don't have the energy or we don't have the capacity or we don't have the like space to want to do it, or really the courage because it is.
Speaker 2:It is like just so, it's so courageous for anybody to really start going down that path of being like, okay, I'm not feeling good, I'm not feeling the way that I want to be feeling like it takes so much fucking courage. And it's not like we always equate courage, like picking up a sword and a steel and like our shield rather, and like going to fight that dragon, but like it's the proverbial dragon, like you know what I mean when we have these deep seated traumas and insecurities, and like behaviors that are in our subconscious mind, like that's where we have to pick up the sword and we have to be like, all right, like I don't I don't want to be doing this anymore, and like I'm going to have to commit to myself and I'm going to have to commit to finding out the why or finding out the cause, and it's going to take a lot of inquiry.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and a lot of time Like it's not, like it's not something, like I feel, like I don't know. I'm sure you can relate to this, like when you kind of get started you're like, okay, this is just going to be like a year. I'm going to just be like in therapy for a year and I'm going to figure out all my shit. Yeah, yeah, I'm like.
Speaker 1:I started with like every two weeks and then it turned into like every month and I was like okay, and then I was like no, I need to keep going, because there's things that are still happening that I don't know how to manage, or things are coming up and I don't understand why, because I felt like we got to the point where I should understand why. But clearly it's going deeper than that and I'm more curious now as to what is happening.
Speaker 2:More curious you get and it's like it's I don't know, it's very remember when I went back to Canada. So we were back in Canada this winter because the World Cup happened here. So like schools are closed for seven weeks, as you do just shut the schools, football tournaments coming, and Liliana had some health complications as well. So we had to actually go for surgery in the States, which was planned kind of correlated, perfect timing. But I remember going there and it was just like when I was home home but back in Canada for that amount of time, like I was so alone and there's just so many expectations put on me and I was just continually failing to meet other people's expectations and I came back here like a fucking broken person, like broken. And what I realize now is I actually was going through like a phase of grief like where I had just kind of given up hope on resurrecting certain relationships in my life and I was mourning the death of that.
Speaker 2:This was coming to the point where I'm trying to make now is that I remember saying to Mike I'm like I can't, I can't do this anymore, like I literally feel like I've like lost my will to live, like I don't want to feel like this and he was like I don't know how long is this going to take, like I'll listen to this episode, so I'm sure I'll be like why'd you say that? But like you know, and in the real thing, but this is it's no fault to him, but it is a very societal expectation that there is a timeframe for how long this is going to take you. And this doesn't exist. Like I'm doing air quotes, this doesn't exist.
Speaker 2:What it is is just a recalibration, a re-instituting that faith and that trust into our intuition Because, like, our intuition will never stray us wrong, ever. That's like a whole belief that I like to share with people. Like, when you are connected to your intuition, then you can heal or not heal, because we talked about this the other day. You can recalibrate, you can come home to yourself, you can have faith in yourself, and I think that is what a lot of people where they've lost. They're not home in their bodies, they're not home in their own belief system or their own reactions or their own emotions and feelings.
Speaker 1:I'm sitting here nodding like yep, yep, yep I saw that yesterday Like yep, I'm having a conversation and realizing that there's a lot of insecurity that's coming up in this conversation and it's being blasted on me and I'm like okay, but I'm securing myself and.
Speaker 1:I'm like, okay, I'm not going to react emotionally, I'm just going to do what I have to do and everything like that. But I love how you brought that up, especially the intuition, because I think that's such a huge piece, and I think when we start to kind of get quiet with ourselves and ask ourselves those questions and start doing the shadow work, some would say, and diving deep into our self, is when our intuition really starts to get louder and start speaking to us.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's like when we talk about this and like this is also something you talk about very frequently, is just like social media. And how perpetuates such a like very what's the word I'm trying to look for? Like it perpetuates like one version of something Like that's what intuition is not like in a million different, like perspectives, like intuition is so individual because we are so individual. So like when people start to go through these inquisitive journey into themselves, like we almost always have in our subconscious, like okay, well, this is what it'll mean. When I'm reconnected with my intuition, intuition, I'll feel like X, y and Z, but like you're setting yourself up for failure and it's hard to differentiate between that, to like really again, have that courage to be like no, you know what I am actually different. This feels different for me.
Speaker 1:And I feel like I can relate to that in two different ways, in the sense that before I went through, I always, I used to always say burnout. I just want to say it was like my crash, my crash and burn, and it was like my own little personal crash and burn, because it wasn't anything catastrophic happened in my life. I guess there was, but doesn't have to and and so. But I felt like I was very, very much connected to my intuition, that and the portion who I was and and everything like that, and really didn't second guess it. And then I kind of lost myself along the way a little bit.
Speaker 1:And when I started to come back to myself and dive deeper into a lot of the things that were happening you know, grief, shame, a lot of things that you have mentioned, a lot of things from my childhood, which was very surprising to me because I had a very loving and happy childhood and I said this to my husband while we were waiting.
Speaker 1:I said I'm shocked that there was things there that were repressed, that I never even thought in my wildest dreams that that is how my childhood was, because to me it just seemed great. There wasn't abuse there. You know, my parents were very loving and there wasn't any of these things that a lot of people experienced, like I thought I was very you know, one in a million type of thing, didn't wasn't raised in a broken home. My parents have been together. They never really fought in front of us, but after going to therapy and realizing a lot of the things and things that I do and how I reacted, things was had a lot to do with my childhood and so I forget where I was going, but anyways, I was talking to my husband.
Speaker 3:I forgot where I was going. There was a point here but I don't remember.
Speaker 1:But anyways, I was just kind of talking to him and just kind of saying like I just didn't think any of that stuff would ever come up.
Speaker 1:And now I remember and so as I'm kind of moving into you know, I don't even want to say this new version of myself I think more of who I am is coming out. My intuition is completely different and it's almost like I had to read, had to understand how to listen to it again and have these little mini tests for myself and it was like simple things, like when I walk my dog. I was like do I go right? Do I go left? Is right safe, is left safe?
Speaker 1:And like safe meaning not like someone's going to harm me, but like is there a dog at this house that's going to react my other two dogs that's going to make me like flail and get like clustered and overwhelmed and, you know, overstimulated in that time. Or am I going to go on this clear, like take the right and go on this clear path? It's going to be really easy and I would do these small little tasks and I would loved it because I would take the right and the moment I turn right I could hear the dog on the left and I was like thank you, thank you Like.
Speaker 2:Also, how many times you go for dinner and you're like, oh, I want the carbonara. Carbonara has like 57 grams of fat and all this, I'll just go for this like Caesar set or whatever, because Caesar fell is just a shit, but like you know me, and like a garden salad, and then you get in your life Well, this was absolutely garbage. It is like I don't feel fulfilled. I like, so I even like with my kids. I'm like, do you guys like, what do you want for dinner? Or like what do you want to do? And I'm like I can see them. So I'm like what was the first thing that popped into your mind? Like we're going to do that and and.
Speaker 2:But you know what, like we are set up, I think, as a society and I and whenever I say like society, I always feel like people will be like, oh, she's a conspiracy theorist, but like, I don't think we are. We are set up to like innately distress our intuition, like the amount of conditioning that a person goes through, and not all of conditioning has a mouth like a mouse. Intent that that is not what I'm trying to say here, but there is a lot of conditioning. Look at media Like, look at the control that it's like perpetuated all the time into our, into our minds. When we start going, like through this, our intuition is going to get blocked. And I like to like I kind of had this epiphany where I was like I imagine our intuition like when we were born.
Speaker 2:Our intuition is like a stream that just comes out of our body. We can all envision a stream or a river or a brook or whatever, especially if you're in Canada. There's 1000 of them everywhere and it you know it's free flowing, you can see. But then, like you know, over years they'll dry up or rocks will be thrown into it and the more rocks that you put in and in this instance the rock is a conditioning belief or a conditioned belief the water is not going to flow so quick, it's not going to flow as freely.
Speaker 2:We add another one, it's not going to flow as freely and eventually it will get damped and then it just stops flowing. But what happens is that the pressure builds, the pressure builds behind, the pressure builds behind, the pressure builds behind and we can either be throwing more rocks on it to suppress it more, or we can start chipping away at it and then you'll get a little geyser, you know. I mean, you'll get a little bit of like the water peeking through over here and that is like our intuition starting to break through. That is, us being able to be like. You know what this, this isn't feeling good for me, like let's move this rock and see what happens, and it's a super foreign feeling at first.
Speaker 2:It's almost like the opposite of when intuition is supposed to do it feel wrong, right, like how dare me just go go with my gut when there's like I got to think about all these other people or all these other obligations that I have to do. But it's like when you feel fulfill other people's cups or when you do things for other people, how do you feel at night when you go to bed? Like you don't feel fulfilled. You feel like that resentment or like that anger, that like sits in your chest and like for most of us like I know I come from a family of that, like generations of that like just like an angry people, like just people who have missed out on opportunities in their lives or miss out on things that they are been forced to do, things that they didn't want to do, and it's like that's what a lot of us are taught, that's what seems to be like the good person, and you're radical if you want to follow your intuition.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you are right, you're so. Yeah, you're selfish, and I kind of want to talk about that a little bit more, because I feel like sometimes this was so brought to my attention all the weekend traveling. I haven't traveled in forever. I haven't traveled in forever, and I and I always walk into this world and give everybody the benefit of the doubt. I believe that every single person is kind, that every single person is mindful of other people that are around them.
Speaker 1:I hate that mindset because, I'm like opposite, my husband's opposite, and I think that's why I'm so strong with it. Like, just give them the benefit of the doubt, they could just be having a bad day. But man, were my eyes opened on the weekend and just being like, would you go to the? Airport Like you went to like you flew in an airplane, I flew in an airplane and it was like that's fucking worst thing that's happened since the pandemic.
Speaker 2:I swear to God, I hate going on the airplane. I'm like everybody is just a horrible person in the airport. I don't know what's happened.
Speaker 1:Yes, I couldn't believe there were. We weren't getting off the plane. Mind you, we were delayed an hour. We sat on the plane, whatever we all wanted to get an hour. Exactly, we all wanted to get off. The flight was two hours Like. Of course. We all are itching to get off this flight, like we're done, I swear. Like when the plane stopped, I swear, someone from the back row ran to the front so they could get out.
Speaker 2:I don't like burns my biscuit more than someone standing up in the seatbelt signs on. I'm like there are safety people. Okay, like my husband's pilot, I understand the world of aviation. Accidents happen. We're all going to the same spot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we'll all get out at the same time, not letting anybody out. It was, it was, and I'm just like, oh my God, porsche, check in. Humanity is not the same. You've been in your little bubble of generosity and kindness.
Speaker 1:But I kind of want to talk a little bit about selfless, like being a little selfish because we talked about that with their intuition, and I think that is where the wires get crossed Right, because someone like that is probably not listening to their intuition. It's a selfless act. They want to get off the plane first. They don't care about anybody else in the plane. Their live is far more busier and better than anybody else. So I'm going to run to the plane. That's my thing.
Speaker 1:I didn't feel like nothing was going to happen, that I needed to run to the plane. My intuition wasn't telling me to get up and jolt to the front, so I was cruel to say. But I think that's where the wires get a little bit cross. And this is where I kind of have conversations with my husband, where sometimes sees the sees people as being selfish and sometimes I feel like it's more like you're connecting to your intuition and you're doing it for you because that's what you need at that time and sometimes I feel like that for myself, like sometimes I'll be like I want this because this is what I need right now, whether it's like I need a cheese pizza because this is what I'm craving but not everybody in my house is craving it. And this is where I find, where it's like my intuition is telling me to do this. Maybe not the cheese pizza, but something, but I almost have to sacrifice a little bit to get there and it almost looks selfish on my end 100%.
Speaker 2:I struggle with that all the time. But two points Person on the plane, 100%, selfish, dick, whatever. But what I will say when we talk about words like selfish, when we talk about words like prioritizing, when we talk about words like I don't know, guilt or maybe guilt's the wrong word.
Speaker 2:There's always a negative connotation with the word thatch, but it isn't in essence a negative thing. To be selfish really just means you're taking care of yourself. Now, it's the expression of how you're taking care of yourself. I think that differentiates between a positive feeling or a negative feeling, because it's almost like when you become a mother or you become a parent, like I'm sure if there's men listening to this they'll be like I'll just mom talk again, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Speaker 2:But it is innately in us Like, let's just be honest, like we are self-sacrificing creatures when we give birth to our children or, you know, our partners as women, our feminine energy, I believe, is very self-sacrificing and it is pushed that way through whatever media that we're consuming. Like you know, it is like oh, mothers give a wife, gives a wife. Does that to be a good person, put out the person's needs ahead of you. But like there is always a cost to that right. So it's like now in our minds we're like oh, I want that cheese pizza.
Speaker 2:Or like for me, for example, because this actually with pizza, happened to me the other night like my kids can't have dairy, that's part of their disease. So we always order like vegan pizza, like vegan cheese. This is not there yet. It's just, it's not. It's. It is not like a pecorino or it is not like a mozzarella. Like I'm sorry, it just can't be, but I will always just eat that shit because that's what my kids have. And like I don't want to spend more money buying myself like a truffle pizza. But I did. This weekend I got like hella courageous and I was like I'm going to order a small truffle pizza for myself because like fuck, I want you like and what, what happened? Nothing, nobody else wanted to eat it, so I got a the whole pizza myself and it was a glorious day. So it's like when I think, when we start shifting our narrative about like oh, she's selfish, that's a negative thing. Is it?
Speaker 2:no, like you mean, we need to take that like negative Feeling around certain words and actually see that there is a positive side for it. Mm-hmm. Yeah, like if you're running, if your house is on fire. And Is it selfish to like want to save your family before somebody else's family, like no, it's not. Like it's your family, it's it's your life, it's your heart. Mm-hmm but it's like in everyday nuances it's. It's always like this selfish thing, and then we forget ourselves.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah and I think, yeah, I like so many things are coming up, especially about feeling selfish, especially, like you know, I always I'm a big preacher of meditation and I talk to people like you know, you really have to carve at the time and you really have to communicate with your family like this is a need that needs to be met.
Speaker 2:Well, you're sort of right or two, and that's like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so like the feeling of selfish like it feels so it does, and I feel like I spent like a good six months training myself to Not be afraid, to be selfish, like I have my daughter at 20, at 20. That's crazy, and I have been like she's 16 now and I'm 36 and I'm like I have spent the last. Oh, my god, we're the same.
Speaker 2:If I cannot imagine having a 16 year old like re nice, the white paper, the son's blood, I Don't like her.
Speaker 1:It's very different. It's very different. Another day never conversation I Said to my girlfriend. I said, don't know, she is young, she's younger children as well. She's same age as me and I said I said, don't ever think that as they get older, they'll need less of you. If anything, it changes and they need more of you and so Don't. Very different way. It's less like in a physical way, like they're neat, their needs still need to be met and they're, they can be very independent, but it's like their emotional needs need to be met, like that's. What I've noticed with my daughter is I'm very much like her therapist.
Speaker 2:But this is why I think that, like a lot of us as parents, like you can only repress that trauma for so long because, sure, you can meet Physical needs, like no problem, like whatever, not, like you know, mean kids get in the mill I mean the bottles, making sure they're not kill themselves. Like jumping off the balcony, like okay, we can all do that. But like, when you start getting into your kids, like going through physical changes, like struggling in school or learning or Sports or friends or bullying or whatever, like that brings up so much and, like you know, kind of like what you said before, when you're like, oh, I didn't really think that I had a lot of like childhood issues. Again, this is where, like when that that negative versus positive thing really comes up, like when we think of childhood trauma, it's automatically negative, it's your parents are music. Yeah, not this, not the kids at all.
Speaker 2:Like a lot of it can come from outside the home. A lot of it can come like, I'm for sure, traumatizing my kids in a certain aspect, because, like, we all have our own issues and things and it's like, okay, but the difference is, is that, like, I'm going to talk about them, I'm going to apologize about it. I'm going to like try to fix all the damage that I've done, but it's a lived experience. Life is a lived experience. It's inevitable. So like I'm kind of jumping around back and forth but like, as your kids get older, I think that's when a lot of parents start really being like the stuff is coming up and I cannot go with it anymore. So it's like after I was saying to Mike, like who's my husband? Like I think a lot of everybody goes through this, everybody is faced with it. So many of us just take that energy that they could use to make it better to just keep fucking pushing it down.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and you will just come, keep coming up, yeah and I think like a lot has to be learned, like I think I'm lucky I'm always being finding out, pregnant just after turning 20 was the most horrifying thing in my life. My husband is nine years older than me, um, so for him it was like the most glorious moment. His friends were having children, they were getting married, like he's, like this is the best. I'm like this is mortifying. Like I like I haven't even finished college. Like I have to go to my last year college pregnant. Like this is insanity, um, but I look back and I'm just so grateful for it because I couldn't even imagine if I had my daughter, let's say, at 31 and she's five now, and growing her like and having her grow up in the society, um, because there's so many things that are coming at you. Like when I had my daughter, we had google, um, but it was like maybe 20 google searches would come up.
Speaker 2:Like this is like 2006, like like honestly, I think I only know how to look at the first page of google be more than 19, like I don't know that there's more pages, even though it says there's 100. I never checked that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like webmd was like literally like one doctor, like it wasn't like all of these different things like it was, and some of the things weren't even on webmd, like at that point in time. So, like I'm so grateful that I wasn't bombarded with a lot of things and a lot of expectations, like If you wanted to know what a mother's expectation was and when I was, you know, when my daughter was growing up and I had my daughter when she was young Um, you had to go to like a mom and me class because, yeah, social development, yeah, like that is the only way that you knew what other mothers were going through, because there was nothing being posted on social media, there wasn't blogs or forums or ticktocks or things to make you feel relatable or understood or anything like that. It was so disconnected. But I'm so grateful of it because I watched a lot of mothers now being like I'm so overwhelmed and I'm like, just turn your all you do a second guess yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because you're like this person did it this way. Like I'm like, I remember it. I didn't even know like bottle feeding existed. Like the nurse that I was like, and you breastfeed, and this is how it works, and I was like I had. No, I had no idea what the benefit of breastfeeding was, what the benefits of bottle feeding were. Like I didn't. There was no like, it was just like here you go, there was no research, and it could be because I was young and I really just I needed to get through college before I could really focus on having a baby at that point in time. Um, and then by the time I was done, I had two months and then that was that and I gave birth. So I was just like I don't know, but it was just I don't know what. Just I feel like Social media, a lot of the things, really put so many expectations on us that we didn't even realize we're there. Turn off, like when you, it's like when you stop watching the news, and how much better you feel.
Speaker 1:Oh, I never. I know my husband. Every day is like what's happening in the world today I'm like I don't know, facebook, nothing's not up on my facebook that stuff is happening.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because they won't tell you if there's anything good happening.
Speaker 1:No, I'm like I don't know if face, if it didn't pop up on my facebook feed. That's what I call my news.
Speaker 2:Seriously, I'm like, if something happens, I'll see it on facebook.
Speaker 1:Yes, I'm like nothing happened in the community. I'm on the community watch, so I think we're good, but I'm like Nothing's on facebook. No, nothing's on facebook anymore, but um, but it's like the, it's that feeling. The moment you kind of Turn down that dial, turn down the noise a little bit, is when you can start breathing and start reconnecting with yourself. And reconnecting. You know the mother that you want to be, or you know the wife or partner that you want to be, and, and so I just think, like I could go on and on and on about social media.
Speaker 2:I'm like I guess I'm like I got 75 things to say to this.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm like I was never on social media before I did social media marketing like I didn't, I didn't know that it existed in the way that it did, like I, I, I, I really had no idea, and so to me it's such an interesting thing and I'm so lucky that I wasn't immersed in it so much because I feel like I can still very much separate myself from it and be like, okay, yeah, but I don't know. We kind of like went off on a little A side chat, but I kind of want to talk a little bit. You had mentioned about capacity and I feel like that's such a big one because, same with expectations external expectations, internal expectations that you put on yourself, capacity is so big and I think really understanding when your capacity is done and I think that was such a big thing for me to learn was like being like I'm maxed, like even yesterday, like yesterday it was such a highly emotional day for me Doing the event and, oh my god, shit was hitting the fan and I was just like breaking down and I'm like, oh my god, and my daughter came home and I had to say to her like it's been a long day emotionally. I just don't have the capacity for everything today, like I, yeah, I'll sit and I'll listen to you and listen about your day and everything, but like I, can't, I, I really don't have the capacity to offer you advice. Like let's circle back to this tomorrow.
Speaker 1:And I actually had to turn down a full conversation with her in the evening. She was on this huge tangent. Her laptop wasn't working, it was the whole. Woe is me. Oh my god, my life is over. I don't have enough money saved to purchase my new computer. But she doesn't want to take anything from anybody else, so it's all her that she wants to save it up.
Speaker 2:So we're like okay, that's a great like quality to have.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm like well, you wanted to do that, that's your expectation that you're putting on yourself. That is nothing to do with me. I always think like that's a you problem, that's not a me problem, and so I actually had to say to her, like she just kept going and I just said, or I said, lily, I am not the person to have this conversation with, not right now, not right now. I'm like I don't know what computer, I don't know what justifies a good computer over a bad computer versus money. I don't know what you're looking for either.
Speaker 1:I don't know what your lab, what's going on with your laptop.
Speaker 1:You know, at the end of the day, like I am not the person to have this conversation with, like I can guide you on how to, you know, feel strong in a convert, like my dad is our big computer guy, worse by bm. So, like she goes to him, I'm, like I can tell you, you know, what to say to papa, so you can hold your ground and, and you know, feel confident in the conversation and say you know, and like you, he, papa, has to remember that you don't have papa's money. Like you have your money and like your budget is very different and your timeline is very different and you want your computer sooner rather than later, so your budget has to shrink. So you need to explain that, because if he doesn't know, then he's just going to continue. You know he's just going to continue to offer these things to you because he wants to help.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but you have to tell him my budget is this or my timeline is this, and then he can find things that will work with you. But you're getting frustrated over something that is kind of your own doing. Just communicate, no one's going to be upset. It's what you want, it's your computer, it's not his who cares.
Speaker 2:Two things. I think the fact that, like, even though you had retrick passing, you were able to articulate like that basic thing to her is Commendable. No, it is. It's really hard and it's really hard to have patients, especially if it's a repetitive conversation that you've had and very, maybe not like directly that you haven't followed the exact same script, but like the points have been made, I'm, I'm I don't know the situation with you and your daughter, but I can guarantee you you've said this to her More than once, on multiple occasions so like a commendable that you have the capacity to do that. I'm sure I don't know, okay, I can't speak for you, but like, when I I'm working on this, but when I feel like I don't have the capacity, I feel weak. When I feel weak, I get angry. When I get angry, my temper goes. When I my temper goes, I have no patience, or maybe vice versa. So, like that, all in all, like Just kind of realizing that you were at your capacity and able to have that conversation with her, was like that's huge. That's huge. And it also teaches her a super valuable lesson too.
Speaker 2:And I don't think that we also Talk about this. Enough is like when we set boundaries and when we say we're at our capacity or we can't do something, like we're not teaching a next generation of people pleasers and we're and we're we're taking that negativity from selfishness to turning it to positivity, because it's not a negative thing to be like I actually can't do this right now Because, at the end of the day, we are all human and, like you know, our nervous system can only handle so much and literally can only handle so much, and it's based on so many different things. But, like For me, learning my capacity and and it is a thing that, like, when I don't have the capacity, I feel like I am just Not a strong person, and for me not to feel like a strong person Because I've always been a super independent person, is like the biggest blow, like the biggest, like I can't. I can't comprehend that I can't be that person. But saying that I am being that person because you can only operate at a your capacity for so long Before what happens. You burn the fuck out, yeah, and then everybody loses you lose, your family loses, your community loses, your home loses, like everything loses because you are not able to be present about it, and it's like I think it's a really hard thing for people to really comprehend.
Speaker 2:When I say I think, I mean I know, it is Like I remember, and it's such a masculine thing, it's such a masculine energy trait to be like I have the capacity for anything and I'm like, well, you don't actually, because, like, let's take inventory of what's actually happening in your life right now, like when you break it down, it's not so easy and that's something that living in Qatar has taught me because, like I'm trying to say this like politically correct here, but like this is a very different place to live. Okay, like the people here are very different, and it's not I'm not saying the Qatari people, I just mean the amalgamation of all the different nationalities here is a very different place to live and it lowers my capacity for so many things. Like just driving my kids to and from school, I get cut off and almost hit like six times. It's just like the driving here is the worst. It actually has the highest mortality rate per capita in the world. Driving in Qatar, it's just so like for me, going to and from school and coming back exhausted, I was like why am I feeling like this, like I have the capacity for so much more Like.
Speaker 2:This isn't even like taking the tip of my capacity, but it is because capacity isn't just what we can physically do.
Speaker 2:It's what we were emotionally at, where we're mentally at, where we are at, like, spiritually, like you know what I mean. It's this whole encompassing thing of so many different aspects of our life, and it's just like when we don't actually just stop and take a check on it. That's when it overflows, yeah, 100%, and it's like a crazy thing. And it's like the more like I always think of it as like a cup, because like capacity is where it is. Or like a cup with a lid, like I have been operating with my lid overflowing for so long and no wonder I'm resentful, no wonder I felt like shit about everything, because like there was nothing left for me. I wasn't creating space for anything else. It's so true, yeah, and it's just like when you have I don't know when you have kids, when you have, when your husband's not home, when it's like you playing the solo role, like, and when you're comparing capacity to other people and what you only see as like a 1% of the reality, like no wonder we're all feeling like about to erupt.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's so true. I had a conversation with a friend of mine a few weekends ago. My daughter was volunteering to cater at a, like a community thing, and I was in the middle of the day. I was helping a girlfriend out with a photo shoot, and so she, we had an arrangement like I would take them to whatever the bus stop was at the high school to get picked up and that the other parent would bring them home.
Speaker 1:And I get this message like, oh so, and so parents unable to do it, now Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I'm thinking, okay, so I'm telling my girlfriend. I'm like, oh my God, now I got to worry about this. I don't have the capacity to worry about this. Like I just wanted to get through this and enjoy my Saturday. Like my week has been busy. I just want to kind of crash and not have to think about everybody else and their to-do list and my to-do list and all the other stuff. And I was like, great, it's. Like it's like 5.30 in the morning. I was like, oh my God, here we go. And my girlfriend's like, oh my God, and you're already like this right, Like you're already like this.
Speaker 1:I'm like, oh God, here we go. And so my girlfriend's like, oh my God, what are you going to do? You're just going to, like, sacrifice your evening and go and get her. I'm like, no, I'm not One, she's 16 years old, she can figure it out. Two, I've sacrificed a lot of my life for her. I need to take some of it back for me because, I don't want to be resentful towards her.
Speaker 1:I don't want, like I want, to have a beautiful, loving relationship. I know what resentment feels like. I lived a long time in resentment and I'm still trying to get over my resentment. I don't want to go back there. I don't enjoy it because if I then say, sure, I'll pick you up and I'm going to be angry the entire day.
Speaker 2:I know I said I'm not letting her say Resentment is the number one relationship killer for any relationship. It doesn't matter if it's a mother, daughter, husband, wife, peer to peer or friends. I feel like resentment is the number one relationship killer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Because you see everything, you're like they're doing this to me on purpose. They don't care about my feelings, they never care. I say this to be home at this time. They purposely come home later, whatever it may be Like, yeah, I lived a very long time in silent resentment.
Speaker 1:No one knew. No, my therapist doesn't even know how he did it. I honestly don't know. And I think it just because I was able to do a lot of other things in my life that fulfilled me and I think it just kind of slowly just shoved the resentment down and made it seem okay to feel that way. I really do think that. Like I think because in my relationship with my husband he gave me so much freedom and other aspects of my life that it justified the resentment that I was feeling, and then later I realized that there's no reason to justify it. It should have always been like an equal partner per thing or whatever it was. And then that's when I kind of learned that like I really need to start communicating and I was forced to communicate. Like when we found out that we were pregnant the second time and then we lost our son. I was forced to communicate because I knew if I chose not to communicate and sit in my resentment. Our marriage would be over in less than a year.
Speaker 2:And that's like the hardest thing to do, because you become so incredibly vulnerable.
Speaker 1:We had to sit there and be like, spew out every single feeling even if it felt wrong.
Speaker 2:I was like what are you saying? This reaction in my stomach? I'm like can't do it, can't do it.
Speaker 1:Like it just like. It was just like verbal diarrhea of emotions and we both had to be equal parts in it, because if I was giving too much and he wasn't giving any, then you're like, how is this fair?
Speaker 2:It's only perpetuating your resentment.
Speaker 1:Exactly Like how is this going to get any better? And I think, like I look back and that was that was the thing, like I don't think our gosh, I don't think our marriage was going anywhere bad or anything, but it really changed our relationship dynamic. It changed how we treat each other. It changed our perspective on how important each other were to one another and how, when we were together, we were significantly stronger and our communication grew and our love for each other grew a lot deeper, in something that was so tragic and something that you never thought that you would ever be able to get out of, like you never thought that the whole that was dug that you would ever be able to climb out of. And we did it and our relationship is stronger, which I think is somewhat rare.
Speaker 1:But I think it was like that realization and I think a lot of the burnout, a lot of things that did happen to me, realized like I can't live this way. I can't, I can't. I'm a happy person. I've always been very happy in my life and I just this is not being angry and resentful and shameful and guilty and all of these emotions is just not. It's just not me and it's heavy and I remember walking into a support group and I really think the support group is what kind of opened my eyes after we lost our son and I've mentioned this before where I walked in and everybody in the circle kind of reshared their story and they're like you know, this happened in like 2014 and I'm like what this happened eight years ago and you're still here, and not in a negative way, like you're still here, like you should be better, like my expectation for you is. You should be healed.
Speaker 1:But it was like. It was like you're still here, I can't be here in eight years. Like, no, I.
Speaker 2:Because it's like oh my God, my path is going to be eight years long.
Speaker 1:Like we kind of want that to fix right.
Speaker 2:But like it's, so independent on who the person is and what they're. Their capacity is yeah.
Speaker 1:Exactly, exactly, and I think everyone's situation was very different and there was a lot of blame and different things, but to me it was just like oh I, I don't want to be stuck for eight years, I don't want to be moving in mud for eight years. Like this was really shitty. That happened to me and happened to our family, and we were very much looking forward to having our son and experiencing this, this part in our lives, because my husband and I were very different people with a second child and so it was such an amazing experience for us. But I was like I can't. I can't be grieving Like I know I'll be grieving forever, but I can't be grieving like on day one forever, like that is hard, and I was just like.
Speaker 1:That was that moment. I was like I can't do it, and that's when I swept it under the rug and I was like I'm fine. And then two years later, it resurfaced and I realized I was not fine and a lot of other things had come up and I'm grateful for that. It was hard and, yeah, I really had to learn to to communicate and and stand up for myself in a way, and all the relationships that I have, the relationship that I had with my daughter. I had to stand up and be like I am my own human being. I'm not just mom, yeah.
Speaker 2:I am Porsche. As parents, we forget, we forget that we are actually like our own person, and our own like sovereign entity. We're not just like this person to take care of other people. And that's like when we step into that role and we really just like embody that role. I think that's where we all reach our capacity and like, if you dare to take something or do something for yourself, like that's the overflow, that's what's got to get cut Right the things for me, because everything else is important, and then that breeds resentment. And then you know, or maybe like resentment is a good feeling to feel for everybody because it can be the biggest catalyst for change.
Speaker 2:I think, like you know, for me I was like I'm resentful towards my kids because of X, y and Z. Like I do everything for them. My mother and my father never did for me. Like why aren't these little dicks grateful to for me, to who I am? But it's not their job to be grateful. No, it's my job just to be like a good parent. So like where what is stopping me from being a good parent? I'm not taking care of myself, I'm not dealing with these issues.
Speaker 2:So it's like maybe it is a good thing Like maybe we all need to go through that kind of thing. Like maybe you know these bad, negative feelings that we see as bad, negative, really they're just illuminators, like really just you know, highlighting. Like okay, this is something that needs your attention and it needs it now. And it's like you either have the choice to do it or you don't. And you took the choice. You took the choice to really I'm going to do that hard work and it hurt and it doesn't mean that like making that choice to do that and be like I don't want to be in day one for eight years, like this is going to be maybe even harder than it was when you lost your son, but like I need to do this.
Speaker 2:That is not selfish and I don't know, it's just. I find, like the narrative that so many of us live by is just so archaic and it's so one size fits all.
Speaker 1:Yeah, 100%. Yeah. It's so true, yeah, and that's what I'm kind of learning now that, yeah, we're all different, and my husband's different than me, my daughter is different from me, and 100%.
Speaker 2:That's what you just had. Someone on with human design, right? No, okay, maybe I like saw anyways, human, go look your energetic imprint, your energetic blueprint. Like we're all different human beings and like doesn't matter if they come from your womb or you know the result of your sperm. They are fundamentally different. They're fundamentally different than you. Yeah, 100%. And like you know, when we all try to make people fit into like a lineup of a certain people or a certain status quo, then it's just not going to work and it's really traumatizing for people. It is To have to feel like you are not meeting up to some sort of expectations that just is not in you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah it's hard, it's, yeah, it's hard. I think yeah, I always go back to social media and just like you know what I was thinking. Sorry, sorry, I didn't try to go ahead, go ahead.
Speaker 2:I was thinking the other night I don't know, I like watch them. Sometimes I watch really good shows and this was like a show like you know about kind of like evolution and people and you know, as human species, like we've evolved over time, like our access to things like food and water and protection, and you know different continents, like we have to evolve to be able to understand and absorb these things. From the time, like you're saying, from when Lily was born to when I had my kids, like the amount of change that has happened is unparalleled to any other generation of human beings that have ever been on this earth. Yeah, and yet we don't take the time to appreciate that. So, like no wonder we're all fucked up to a certain degree because, like we're not meant to change and take all these things so quickly and it's like very discombobulating for our systems, like our nervous systems need to evolve to be able to adapt, and it can involve an attack egg.
Speaker 2:I said involve, but I meant evolve. Yeah, you know what I mean. It can't, it can't, and like it's just you know the messaging that comes out of that. Like you, we all feel like failures for certain things and like we have. We're so living in such a comparative society where it's like it's insane, it's insane, everybody moral to circle. Delete your Instagram, exactly.
Speaker 1:I'm like filter it, filter it. You know, it's so true. Like I'm on TikTok a lot, I love to talk. I love to talk because I don't know anybody on there, so I really can't compare myself to them. I don't appreciate it.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to lie, like sometimes when I need to get, lol. Oh yeah, crazy. I'm like give me three seconds. I need to like find some sort of reals right now to like bring my mood back up.
Speaker 1:Exactly. But I watch a lot of mums on there I don't know if that's my feed Like I'm not even. I'm not having a baby anytime soon or ever again, but I watch. And I watch because I grew up in a very different time. And I watch because, like all the little gadgets that they have and the routines, and I'm thinking, wow, what a lot of pressure, fucking so much pressure.
Speaker 2:I'm like that's intense. I get notes from my kids school, like not me personally, because I feel like I just had to validate that but like, don't send your kids with X, y and Z to school, and I'm like, jesus Christ, I just need to get them up in the morning and pack a lunch. Like, can you just give me that? Like yeah, I'm okay with that meeting, whatever like, can you just be okay with them eating whatever? Like, please, just like, give me this one thing. I'm sorry I put some sour patch kids in there. Like I had to do it, okay, yeah, I also put some turkey and I put some cucumbers too. So, like, yeah, there's just so much pressure it's to do. I don't even know, like, who made that expectation.
Speaker 1:I don't know like I'm thinking and I was like, oh my God, like I remember I made my daughter's baby food and that was frowned upon when my daughter was growing up. Because no one did that, there was no expectation.
Speaker 2:I had to make my daughter's baby food and it tasted like shit. So I was like let me just go buy this thing in a squeeze pack. I don't care, there's sugar in it. Welcome to real life. There's going to be sugar in her diet, like later on, like I don't know there's so much pressure, so much pressure, and about every single aspect.
Speaker 1:I watching friends that have babies on my Instagram and they talk about it and I'm just thinking, wow, I couldn't. I couldn't do that. I'm so grateful that I didn't know who I was. I didn't know what the hell was happening every single day because I didn't have anything to tell me what I should be experiencing or what size my baby should be or or anything like that, if they should have teeth or talking, and I don't know. I really had no idea. I only compare it to a friend of mine that had a kid, or you know, six months older than mine and I thought, okay, for around the relatively the same age.
Speaker 1:Maybe people do things relatively at the same time, but if we don't, at the end of the day, all happen, like my mom said, we were potty training her and I was like I don't know. Like is she too young? Is she too old? I have no idea. How am I supposed to do this? Like? Do I just let her be naked? Do I try to party? Do I do a treat like I don't know? How do I train my kids to pee?
Speaker 2:This is the way we snuff our children's intuition to right because it's not showing us when they're ready, but Sally down the road kids already peeing and pooping in a toilet, and they're two months younger than my kids, so, like my kid must be some sort of developmentally delayed child, exactly.
Speaker 1:So my must head, don't worry, there's no 12 year old. But you know other. You know in no sense that's no 12 year old that can't go to the bathroom on a toilet, like so she and they put it in perspective where I was like, oh, I'm freaking out about this small moment.
Speaker 2:We're really, in the grand scheme of things, it will probably be forgot about it now, like how old was when you potty trained her? I honestly have no idea Exactly. Jack still sleeps in bed with me like six out of seven nights a week. He'll be seven in like a month and a half.
Speaker 3:Oh we close that forever I love it, I love it.
Speaker 2:Give her a stinky breath in the morning. I want to smell it, because soon you're not even going to want to touch me. Yeah, like you wouldn't mean like one of my girlfriends here. She's like I got to get my kid off. She'll probably listen to this too and I love you, but like I have to get my kid off of the soother. And I was like this is something for me.
Speaker 2:When we lived in Hungary, both my kids are super small. In Hungary kids are like seven years old walking around the soother in their mouth. Like that's just what they do there. Like everybody's kind of chill with it. All right, some people got some buck teeth, but like nothing braces can't fix nowadays in Canada or in like Western Europe, it's like get that soother out of the kids mouth. Maybe your kid needs that sort of like with the word comfort.
Speaker 2:What's wrong with that? That's their intuition saying I need this to make me feel safe and mommy's telling me that it has to go out because some doctor told her that it needs to come. Like that's where it starts, right. Like that's where it starts. And like how many times in your gut you're like oh, I want, I want Jack, right, I want Lily to have that for a little bit longer because, like my kids, I want to like, because I know they need that. But, like I'm looking on Instagram or I'm looking on like Pinterest or I'm googling, you know, I'm on page five of Google searches and I've already read 15 articles that said stop doing it. But my intuition is telling me something different. Isn't it crazy? It's crazy, like, if you want information, if you want to go to the like the bowels of hell, post on a mom's Facebook group. That's where you're gonna be shamed the most and that's where, like you know, everybody's gonna come out of the woodwork. I think, I actually think it's probably like the worst place in the universe Moms Facebook groups.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm not part of any.
Speaker 2:No, I have nothing to talk about. Get yourself off of those Facebook groups right now. Just focus on like two or three good friends, yeah, and get your advice from them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I just I know none of my friends have kids my age. So All my kids have young kids. Are all my kids. All my friends have young kids.
Speaker 2:I like kids and beyond kids, I'm already a grandma.
Speaker 1:All right, sure, I take that any day. I love a little baby, but, yeah, it's just. It's such a wild, wild time and I think so many of us, and myself included, just get lost in the noise of the world and Put so many labels and so many expectations and emotions on that noise for ourselves and we just kind of absorb it and make it our own when really it's just, it's not and, and so I'm not no, like yeah, we, I don't know, I don't know what it is Nothing's really ours.
Speaker 2:Like you to mean the experience that you're gonna pay.
Speaker 2:Well, your experiences that you're going through are your experiences, but it's not like a completely unique and individual experience Like a lot of people have gone through very similar and, yeah, experience.
Speaker 2:That's kind of why I'm like trying to openly share these type of things with people, because, as much as we're all connected, we're even more I know this is like a cliche thing as much as we're all connected, we are way more lonely and we're all way more individualized and like feel like we can't be authentic to who we are. But like Again, I've said this I don't somebody count how many times I said the word repressed. Yeah, I'm doing this. But like, the more you repress your emotions or your feelings and stuff, the more you feel lonely and it's it's really just should be the opposite of that the more that we come together as a community and the more that we share Like hey, I felt this too, or I went through this too the less shitty we feel about ourselves and the less shitty we feel as a community and as a society and like I don't know, I don't know it's. It's a very weird paradox that we live in, yeah it's so true.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like, oh my god. I could go on and on and I know I know realization about loneliness a few weeks ago in my childhood, and so like I'm still trying to like wrap my head around that, because I've learned that my childhood was lonely and I I was like the epitome of a lonely person.
Speaker 2:I swear to God, I'd be like find somebody on the stream Like what are you doing?
Speaker 1:But see, my loneliness was different, where it was like I wasn't. I was surrounded by people, but I was always lonely, like I was always the one out picked last, the weird one, the loud one, the one that's too much or too silly or took things too far, and so I was just always that person. And, mind you, I'm a middle child and the only daughter, so I don't older brother and an older, younger brother. So they got along and so I Was very much played alone, like they didn't want to play Barbies or house or do all of these things. They had their own things that they wanted to do. And then, as I got older, I was the sister and they didn't want me to be around their friends, and so it just became I grew up in the middle of nowhere, so it just became like this very drop.
Speaker 1:I just grew. I grew up kind of an. I grew up not far from where I live now in northern Back then. Back then I grew up in the middle of nowhere, yeah, so it was like it was a small town. So if you lived in town you could walk to people's houses. But I didn't live in town.
Speaker 2:I love townies.
Speaker 1:It was like 15 minutes from town, from our like two-street town. I, you know, for me to go anywhere took effort. I had to ask my parents and different things like that. So it was just, it wasn't convenient. That's why my daughter like that's why where we live now. This is the main reason why we live where we live now. We live in a subdivision that's in our town so she can get to her friends and do all of these things, because that was something that I never got. My husband did later on. But it was important for me to have her connected to people if she wanted to be connected to them. I wasn't forcing my like and like go play with your friends outside. Most sometimes I'd be like go play with them, just go back up, they'll be fine.
Speaker 2:You know what it is like. It's funny like one good thing about living here is like it's safe in that aspect, like there's no Crime. I'm just trying to show there's crime happens everywhere. Maybe it's not talked about, for sure it's not talked about, but like we live in like a compound, so like the kids can literally go out I'm worried about them getting hit by a car, but like I'm not worried about like something perverse happening to them. I, like you know I mean Something like that. It's funny when you say that you were lonely. See, I grew up as an only child. I also felt like that too, like nobody to play with, like had to go make my own fun. I felt like an inconvenience, like if you needed to do something. Like yeah, it's really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and like I was surrounded, like I had a babysitter, there was like six or seven of us, like always together, every single. Well, this was a long time ago.
Speaker 2:I think they call them daycares now, but like we call it a babysitter.
Speaker 1:I think it was like a day I had to be a babysitter, for sure, but I was more like a babysitter but I guess I guess it was a daycare, I guess I don't know after school program at somebody else's house, I don't know, but we were always surrounded by people, but it was very much like alone, like it was just. It was just. I Never really realized it until, like one of my insecurities had came come up and I, you know Talking to my therapist about it and we're trying to understand, like, where it was rooted from, because it wasn't something that happened recently or in the last like 15, 16 years, because a lot of my traumas come came from Having my daughter so young. There was a lot of different things expectations, insecurities, a lot of proving people wrong, that type of stuff. To me I never really looked at my childhood because I always thought it was fine, it wasn't. I guess it was, it was, it was fine.
Speaker 1:But like there's just things, I guess, that I just never really even realized and it was interesting how some of these Things that come up, some insecurities or just different emotions to different situations come up that are Are complex and I'm like I don't, I don't myself. I don't understand why I'm feeling this way. So I kind of need to talk this out, and I often go to my therapist and talk it out, because it's and that's when we kind of find the root. And that was like this loneliness. I went back. I think I was upset for like two days, like I was just in shock that I was like wow, I just realized I'm so lonely and I almost like went into this like depressive state, like I was like I can't believe that was my life For so long but anyhow, like both have similar experiences but like from two very different causes.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm, like you said, you came from a very loving family. Mm-hmm, like you didn't mean and I'm sure your parents, like would be heartbroken to hear that you felt really lonely as a child, like everything that they work not to have Mm-hmm, but it's still like it's so, like loneliness is such, I don't know, a gross feeling, I don't know what a better word is like it's all encompassing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like it takes over your entire body, like when I feel lonely, and it happens a lot and it's weird because I'm very social, but I get very lonely states. At least every once every two weeks I get into this lonely state. It's it's like a whole, it's like a full-body experience where it's like my stomach is upset, my heart is heavy. It's not like my body aches, but it's just like everything is dark inside of me and and you're and sometimes it's not even mental like, sometimes it's not even. I'm like, oh, I know something's wrong With me right now. I know I'm not feeling myself and it's not until, like the day goes on or something happens or something triggers me around, like, oh my god, it's my loneliness. That's kind of come up and, okay, how do I shake this off? Do I go out and go grab a cup of coffee and have an interaction with somebody? And then I then I'm like, oh my god, am I gonna come off desperate because I'm gonna talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, talk. I'm so lonely right.
Speaker 1:That's like I'm in a verbal diarrhea on them. So I was like I don't want to.
Speaker 1:You know exactly, am I too much? I don't want to call a friend because I don't want to, you know, burden them with my loneliness, because I'm really lonely right now, like I don't want to call my mom, so I don't want to tell her that I'm lonely. I don't want to call my husband, I don't want to tell him that I'm lonely, and then he'll think he needs to leave from work. I'm gonna support me and I'm like, and then, but then I don't do anything. I sit there and I'm like I'm still so lonely and I talk to myself and I don't like interaction what helps you get out of that?
Speaker 1:Honestly, I tend just to kind of sit with it. I know for myself it's not something that tends to linger more than a day or two. Often it is something that was external, that triggered me to feel lonely. So it could have been a comparison to another business. Maybe I'm trying to do the same thing at the same time as this other person and they're succeeding and I'm not. So then I could go into the shame of like I'm a nobody. I might as well do nothing, say nothing, yeah, not be that not be seen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so I often know and I often can realize that and typically I just kind of let myself feel it and just move through it, rather than try to go into like a fix it mode and be like I need to do this. Sometimes I will pick up the phone, often I will kind of talk to my husband about it. If I still feel it like Going longer into my day and it really is affecting me and I find myself, you know, sitting on TikTok all day because I'm just trying to drown myself in something else, or things that did bring me joy are not bringing me joy in that day, like sitting outside, I'm like itchy and want to get up and move or feel irritated by it. Then I'm like, okay, I think I need to kind of do something else. But often I just sit and and really reflect on it and but I think that's where I'm at like I know for myself, I Know I'm not going to sit in it longer than a day or two, like I just know that for myself.
Speaker 1:I know myself very well, I know the feelings. So for myself I'm never worried like this is going to be me for the next two months or anything like that I just know like this is what's happening and I have to just give myself a lot of grace and a lot of kindness in that moment and I often will make note of it and talk to my therapist about it to kind of really Find tools or different things to kind of support myself through it. But yeah, I just, I often don't do anything, but I really really find myself talking to myself and understanding, like when the dialogue starts changing and starts becoming a little bit More dark or a woe is me or I'm not good enough that type of thing, that's when I'm like okay.
Speaker 1:We know better.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like we know better Porsche, we have the tools. We know what we need to do right now. Let's, let's just one step at a time, let's. Why don't we go up and just lay down on our bed for a little bit and Maybe put some meditation on or put a timer on, and and don't have an expectation to sit there the whole time or listen to the whole Meditation the whole time or whatever? Just just be and find things that feel good for you and don't feel guilty if it's not what you were expected to do today, and I usually just kind of move with it.
Speaker 2:I feel like Expectations are also just so toxic, like you need to have expectations in life and you need to have expectations, like for people, for how they treat you and you know what you expect to get out of putting energy into something. But like that's a very fine line, because I think expectations which are fueled by like a lot of the things that we see and from a comparative standpoint, just we inevitably just set ourselves up for failure because like again, maybe we're at our capacity, we didn't hit that expectation. We're gonna start spiraling into loneliness and low South Worth and shame and guilt and it's just like, yeah, you need to come out of that, or you, not you need to come out of that. Because that's also just like putting another expectation, like I need to do this. But it's like which is like what I heard from you a lot, like I have the compassion now for myself. Yeah, you know it'll come and it'll go. Yeah, I just have that faith in myself that I will get through it. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:Yeah and I have to know that not every day is gonna be perfect. No, and I'm gonna feel low and I'm still moving through all of this and I feel significantly better than what I did six months ago, and that's amazing. So if I have one shitty day every two weeks, that's okay. I'm okay with that. It's part of the process. Things are still coming up for me and you know, I over stimulate myself and often that's what happens and it's kind of the Recreation, what's?
Speaker 2:how could you not over stimulate yourself? Literally even that, if you have access to the internet, you're gonna over simulate yourself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so yeah, but anyways, we should stop here. Okay, but I would love to have you back on again. I just think you know.
Speaker 2:I have a lot to say so like yeah. I think it'd be so good. I got my throat, so I'm like. I always am like yeah.
Speaker 1:And I think I would love to talk a little bit more about loneliness and really go into that, into that and and the trend that we see and I know what that we experience and I think this is a big thing with the we experience, and why I'm so passionate about, you know, people being seen and heard is because I'm a person that often feels not seen and heard, and so I want to give that space to other women, to other people, so they they do feel bad and feel less alone in this world in whatever they're doing, and so I would love to kind of continue that conversation in loneliness.
Speaker 1:And then the other side of that as well is like the support of being seen and heard and and what that can look like, because for everybody that looks different. To be seen and heard looks different for everybody, like what I like to, for me to feel seen and heard, it's very different from what you like and and what makes you feel good. So I would love to have that conversation again. Let's set it up Awesome. Well, thank you so much, megan. It was such a pleasure and honestly, I think honestly, of course thank you for having me on here.
Speaker 2:Like I was super nervous to start this conversation, but like just the fluidity of it and like how open and accepting it is, it was like Change my expectation.
Speaker 1:Well, that's what we're all about and that's, honestly, this is what the podcast is all about is is really having giving the space for others to share and feel open and safe, because that's what I want in this world for myself and I want to be your daughter. Yeah, and I want to give that to everybody. So thank you, my pleasure.
